DDD L3-S1: looking at Stenum

[Corry]

As the sig says, began the pain in 2001, at age 20....yeah, young, stupid and immortal. Not only did I move the 350-400lbs beast, I twisted while doing it...successful though!

Anyhow, I had really hoped the maverick was going to be available stateside, or something other than the prodisc and charite which wear out a little too quickily for my young blood. Unfortunatly, medtronic didn't see fit to appeal the injunction against the device. I could care less if I had to pay syntheses for their so called patent, I just want my back fixed with a device thats not going to find me undergoing a 50% mortality rate rework surgery in 10 years (or less with the way I am). I don't think the courts should have sided with syntheses in the first place given the prior art, and the fact that the USPTO wouldn't issue the patent when it specifically mentioned the keel (yeah, thats what the holdup is, Syntheses thinks it can patent a keel), but I digress.

I've pretty much given up on the US at this point. I've missed my 20s thanks to the US system, I'd rather not miss my 30's! So I'm looking into Stenum. They had a look, and agreed, L3-S1 need replacing. I'm a little annoyed that it seems like high pressure sales right now....maybe I'm misinterpreting things, but $46K isn't cheap to an individual, and without owning a home, difficult to get a loan for. I suspect with a predetermination, the banks might not balk so much. So I'm here to learn from the experience others have to offer.

So far, what I know is Aetna gave me a fax number to fax in a request. They said they wanted the diagnosis, letter of medical necessicity, diagnostic codes, and a breakdown of fees codes, and all "provider info" (information on Stenum Hospital). I'm in contact with Sue Hart of course, but I figure the more information and other people's experiences I go in with, the better off I will be. I suppose my backup plan will be to switch insurance providers....I think I might be able to get in on one that has a relativly good success rate, but for now, I'd like to get this done ASAP.

So thats about it, there's my intro

[ajj1001]

welcome to the forum, sorry that you've had such a lot to contend with. getting a solution that's going to last you is really important. I had a two level ADR that didn't sort things out for that long :-(

[Hooch]

Gday mate, I'm in a similar situation, bugger all activity plus meds and pain is manageable, surgery would be for quality of life.

I got an email back from stenum, gotta say i was surprised, no real interest in diagnosis, just deposit the cash and get a 'free breakfast'. Mind you when you cut out all the bs it's the same surgical solution. Let them wait, they'll still be there when you're ready. Good time to get second opinions.

Stenum are offering M6 lumbar now, so I suppose you'd have to ask them to do the maverick.

Where are you getting all that info about the lifespan of prodisc? I haven't heard anything about the plastic in there wearing out that quick.

Welcome aboard.

[KBear]

Welcome to the forum and sorry you find yourself here. Just curious are you looking to have 3 ADR's or a hybrid? I would personally fuse L5/S1 and do ADR at the other 2 levels, as I don't think 3 ADR's in a row is a good idea and can cause more issues. I also would get multiple opinions, even if you have zero intention of using the places, their opinions can help pick out potential problems. There are several places here and abroad that will give you a 2nd opinion for free or a small fee, check out travel for spine surgery in the travel section for more information. Best of luck, Kathy

[Justin]

Corry,

Welcome to the Spine Patient Society.

I believe we have spoken in the past. I fully understand having your "20s taken from you" -- I've been there too. Have a look around the Surgical Outcomes Forum --> Click here. There are many unique stories from Spine Patients (young & old) that might help you, as you get closer to surgical intervention.

Let us know how we can help.

[Cindylou]

Welcome Corry,

Lots of good advice already given. I hope you find a solution soon so you can get on with the business of living! Best, Cindylou

[Katie]

I'm glad you made your way here Corry

I'm surprised at both your and Hooch's comment about the high pressure sales tact that you got from Stenum. I had contacted them several times over the past four years to get a diagnosis and quote for the cost, and the price was barely mentioned. They spent a great deal of time going over my options and what was happening with the various levels.

I have to admit that after several false starts with my insurance, when I had to cancel tentative dates when things went south, that their communication got rather slim. But I can't really blame them for that...I was starting to look like a flake

Thankfully everything came together with another surgeon this spring for me. But i have to say that I have at least a dozen friends and acquaintances that have had wonderful success with surgery at Stenum. Perhaps their approach has changed since I last dealt with them, but I haven't heard of anyone else with the same issue.

Good luck with everything and keep asking questions.

[Corry]

Justin,
Now that you mention it, I think we have spoken, over on ADRSupport? I came over here because there was a post from a member who has mostly sucessfully battled Aetna, who is my current provider. I want to go in armed with enough info!
As for stenum, all my communication has felt very short, and like its tiresome. I've tried to be as friendly as possible...but it seems more like they just want to cut to the chase, and picking up $46K should be a breeze!

As for solutions, I have done a lot of my own research, enough that I don't particularly want medical professional's opinions, especially since in general, they give you the same info you can find online, perhaps because they don't believe you can be as smart or smarter than they are. I picked software, but nearly switched to medical. I am pretty confident in my decision. The only question I had was about the 3 level ADR vs the hybrid fusing of L5-S1. What the most recent thinking I can find on this is that the L5S1 doesn't move much, but if you have already had SI problems, you may want to reconsider the idea of Fusing L5-S1. I personally have some...difficulty with my SI joint..and SI injections are painful. I'm not a huge fan. Beyond that, I can't seem to find much on the rational of fusing/adr at the L5-S1 level anymore. It may be with the M6, that motion is restricted well enough in a natural enough fashion to prevent the problems that were well discussed about the Charite in that position.
On another quick note, apparently, Spinal Kinetics claims to have tested the device out to 45 years, but I couldn't find whether that was in the lumbar position...Still working on that. The M6 seems like a better option as long as longevity is not an issue....more as I find it

[Carson]

Whats up, Corry

If interested in a particular clinic always key to talk with former patients. Some Stenum patients on the forums include: David G. (dagmountain) recent 3 level lumbar, Kathleen in Alaska (WPKat) recent 2 level lumbar, Mark (Rhatzy), Willie Beeson, Rob Wilson who can also help you with SI questions, Terry Newton and Bob (trkdoc714).

It takes some work but lots of folks out there willing to help. Best of luck.

[helmut]

Hi Corry, I had L4L5 replaced at Stenum 4 weeks ago, with an M6 and I am very happy about it.
I know its confusing and frustrating when you just want to get it done and move on with your life, I also feel like I have lost quite a few years during the past ten years. So I assume you sent your MRI's to Stenum and they suggested ADR. You are obviously very young which reduces any risk of osteoporosis and if everything else like your facets check out and you don't have any misaligned vertebrae, then it may be a pretty straight forward diagnosis I think, especially from Stenums professional perspective. You mustn't forget that most other famous doctors in europe with many times less ADR experience than Dr Ritter Lang won't even respond unless you send them money and then they will charge by the half hour. I felt that the response I got from Stenum was very down to earth, Malte Peterson explained the situation to me and answered all my questions without me paying a dime which I thought was great. There are thousands of spinepatients out there who are sending their info to hospitals for evaluation.

I really hope that you can manage to get your insurance company to pay for it, its sad but true that it costs a lot of money but still less than it would here in the US. Good luck to you!